So magic man, I guess you're one of those American's who touts the "party line" about our soldiers keeping us free.
I disagree.

The first part of my argument is that we simply are not free.
I discovered I wasn't free when, in 1987 I decided to open a store.
I learned that I had to get the federal, state, county and city government's permission to open a business and sell my skills.
I learned that I had to pay a bribe to these various government entities to prevent them shutting me down and probably arresting me.

I started looking at all aspects of our lives; I began reading and spending vast amounts of time in the law library of the world-class private University near my condo. I began to digest the fact that were it not for that elephant in the room, the one that demands a fee from ever minute aspect of every part of everyone's life, keeps the lion's share, then doles out some allegedly needed "services" to a mostly ignorant or at least cowed populous, we'd be free.

(I couldn't seem to get the fire inspector to come out and inspect. She was always "in a meeting" or otherwise busy. I desperately called and begged her to please come and inspect, and she instead asked me about my lighted exit signs and fire-extinguishers and, over the phone, deemed me fit to open my business.
Six months later she strolled in. She commented on something I had in the case. Asked the price, held it....waited during an uncomfortable silence...then left. The next week I got an order from the city to shut down due to fire violations. You see, I missed my cues. I didn't take seriously the warnings from people like George Santayana. I was supposed to GIVE that merchandise to that inspector! Because I didn't pay the tithe, I was shut down!)

This didn't happen in Tennessee, but it happened in a state in the U.S.A. It happened in a country that sent millions of men to die for dubious causes, many enslaved against their will, and it is prima facie evidence that we are not free!

Up until 1973, there was a draft, and men were dragged from their lives, had weapons thrust into their hands, and were ordered to murder other men, women and children for the dubious reason of "keeping us free" from tyranny. And the truly sad part of this terrible truth is that too few people understand that that IS tyranny! That is what tyranny does.

The second part is the idea that those who now join the military are "our" anything.
In spite of the garbage spoken by one president in his second inaugural speech, we are not a "government of by and for" anything other than itself.
I am not the government! I cannot be the givernment, and in fact most American's are not and cannot be "the government."
We are ruled. And those who join the military? They are the police of the state. They voluntarily, with both eyes open, joined the "service."
They keep the government free from those who would prefer NOT to live under tyranny.

I've heard the argument that because we can vote every two to four years for a change in our guards and wardens, we are free. But the obvious wrongheadedness of this argument would be quickly evident if the voting machines were all broken at once and nobody's vote was counted: Some man or woman would still be inserted into the government slot, and their rule over us would carry on without even a burp.

So I ask y'all, since those soldiers remain dead even after the Official Day of Remembrance every year, what are some proofs that we are indeed free?

(If I posted this to the wrong place the government of this board is welcome to move it...or fine me for breaking the rules)

Doc wrote:

So magic man, I guess you're one of those American's who touts the "party line" about our soldiers keeping us free.
I disagree.

Sorry not!!!

What I trout is that I spent 27 years
in the US Army defending your right to make statements like this!

I would do it again and would I pick
“persons who disagrees with me” not to defend .......NO!

So wait, you joined the federal police force 10 years after the end of the Viet Nam war?
Were you guarding Donald Rumsfeld in December of that year when he was over in Iraq playing kissy-face with Saddam Hussein?

What exactly did you and your fellow federal police do in those 27 years to defend me against the tyranny that would silence me?
And which group of thugs did you imagine could/can take away my inalienable right to speak? The Russian's? The Chinese? The Iranian's? Heck man, they don't have any authority to shut me up in America! There is only one group of people legally and physically able to accomplish that task. YOU were/are one of those who could turn tyrant and do so. Only my government governs me, and thankfully they've not stolen this right...yet. But as they chisel so too will our rights further crumble.
The Right to Free Speech is the bread of the Bread and Circuses as is voting.

Quote :

You sed: I would do it again and would I pick
“persons who disagrees with me” not to defend .......NO!

Wow. You mean you would do what you were told regardless of who the target of your largess might be? Big of you.
If your commanding officer instructed you to go house-to-house confiscating guns from American's would you fall on your sword for our God given right to keep and bear arms, or would you do as you were told?

Doc wrote:

So wait, you joined the federal police force 10 years after the end of the Viet Nam war?

My service included Viet Nam..guest that makes me a baby killer?

Quote :

If your commanding officer instructed you to go house-to-house confiscating guns from American's would you fall on your sword for our God given right to keep and bear arms, or would you do as you were told?

Assnine statement not worthy of a comment!

Quote :

My service included Viet Nam..guest that makes me a baby killer?

If you were drafted against your will you have my sympathy and welcome home. If you joined I'll guess you were misguided at best.

So tell me again why the American government spent all those millions of dollars and lives in SE Asia. Were the North Vietnamese going to curtail my right to free speech?

Quote :

Assnine statement not worthy of a comment!

Do you recall the last time house to house gun confiscation was done in America?

Doc wrote:

Quote :

My service included Viet Nam..guest that makes me a baby killer?

If you were drafted against your will you have my sympathy and welcome home. If you joined I'll guess you were misguided at best.

So tell me again why the American government spent all those millions of dollars and lives in SE Asia. Were the North Vietnamese going to curtail my right to free speech?

Quote :

Assnine statement not worthy of a comment!

Do you recall the last time house to house gun confiscation was done in America?

I was in the military before Viet Nam started!

Quote :

If you were drafted against your will you have my sympathy and welcome home. If you joined
I'll guess you were misguided at best.

Guess that means that if I join than my sorry butt should not have returned except in a body bag!

The only thing misguided is you thinking I was misguided!

Quote :

So tell me again why the American government spent all those millions of dollars and lives in
SE Asia. Were the North Vietnamese going to curtail my right to free speech?

Since I did speak of this ….. I can not reiterate it!

Quote :

Do you recall the last time house to house gun confiscation was done in America?

They would not get mine even if they did this!

Quote :

...Guess that means that if I join than my sorry butt should not have returned except in a body bag!

I don't know you.
You likely have family who are glad you returned.
But if you think your joining "kept" us free you are mistaken.
It's more likely that you joined because a respected family member fought in WWII and you were steeped in the non-philosophy of gunghoism...
Or you came from a poor family and thought you'd get some freebees on the G.I. Bill. Of course you now know the value of that!

Quote :

The only thing misguided is you thinking I was misguided!

But hey, I sure could be wrong! (I've been wrong 47 times in the past!)

Why did you join?

Doc wrote:

So tell me again why the American government spent all those millions of dollars and lives in
SE Asia. Were the North Vietnamese going to curtail my right to free speech?

Magic Man wrote:

Since I did speak of this ….. I can not reiterate it!

That's OK, I know the answer: The military-industrial complex funded both Presidential candidates as they do every single election, and pay-back was in order. There are too many people in America who cannot seem to wrap their minds around simple economics and who actually believe that war and other disasters help an economy.
A man named Frederic Bastiat wrote an essay and one of the chapters is entitled "The Broken Window."
I link here to the entire essay: "That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen" of course those young geezers who already know everything (present company excluded) won't bother.

Doc wrote:

Quote :

...Guess that means that if I join than my sorry butt should not have returned except in a body bag!

I don't know you.
You likely have family who are glad you returned.
But if you think your joining "kept" us free you are mistaken.
It's more likely that you joined because a respected family member fought in WWII and you were steeped in the non-philosophy of gunghoism...
Or you came from a poor family and thought you'd get some freebees on the G.I. Bill. Of course you now know the value of that!

Quote :

The only thing misguided is you thinking I was misguided!

But hey, I sure could be wrong! (I've been wrong 47 times in the past!)

Why did you join?

Doc wrote:

So tell me again why the American government spent all those millions of dollars and lives in
SE Asia. Were the North Vietnamese going to curtail my right to free speech?

Magic Man wrote:

Since I did speak of this ….. I can not reiterate it!

That's OK, I know the answer: The military-industrial complex funded both Presidential candidates as they do every single election, and pay-back was in order. There are too many people in America who cannot seem to wrap their minds around simple economics and who actually believe that war and other disasters help an economy.
A man named Frederic Bastiat wrote an essay and one of the chapters is entitled "The Broken Window."
I link here to the entire essay: "That Which is Seen, and That Which is Not Seen" of course those young geezers who already know everything (present company excluded) won't bother.

I think that if you did not shovel so much horsepucky than more people would enjoy your posts.


As it is, it is hard to get pass the smell to see if there are worm in it …..to see if medication is
need!

I'll accept your privation of thought and move on then.
I recognize ad hominem attacks for what they are.
Wallow in your nescience and call me in the morning.